PPP, Afro-Guyanese groups slam each other over “Indian” vs “Afro” GECOM Chairman

PPP, Afro-Guyanese groups slam each other over “Indian” vs “Afro” GECOM Chairman

Several African Guyanese organizations on Friday October 27, 2017  lashed out at the East Indian-dominated People’s Progressive Party for submitting 18 mostly East Indian nominees for the post of Guyana Elections Commission in a bid to force President David Granger to select one of them.

“The recent Constitutional appointment by His Excellency David Arthur Granger has publicly revealed what Africans in Guyana and the Caribbean all know, Indians do not want to be ruled by an African Leader because they believe they are superior to Africans,” the African Cultural and Development AssociationPan African Group (Guyana) Branch, The All African Guyanese Association and Concerned Citizens in the Diaspora said in a joint statement.

Read more: http://demerarawaves.com/2017/10/28/ppp-afro-guyanese-groups-slam-each-other

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  • hinduindianvoice  On October 29, 2017 at 5:03 am

    I would like to take up the opinion expressed by several African associations that ” Africans in Guyana and the Caribbean all know, Indians do not want to be ruled by an African Leader because they believe they are superior to Africans.”

    I will agree with the first part that Indians do not want to be ruled by an African leader, for very good reasons. African leaders of government in Guyana have been an absolute disaster for Indians, for which I quote Forbes Burnham an absolute racist and dictator who drove out Indians by the tens of thousands, Desmond Hoyte who continued the Burnham agenda, and now David Granger also continuing the Burnham agenda. I will not include Sam Hinds, who was president for just a few months.

    The second claim that Indians believe they are superior to Africans is a bit tricky, as the associations did not specify in what ways Indians believe they are superior to Africans. I will try to help.

    Are Indians as a group (in Guyana) superior to Africans as a group in fact? Or are they equal? Or are they inferior? I believe many Africans believe that Africans are superior to Indians, but I will not take that up now.

    Understand that when we talk of Africans in Guyana, we talk about a group that has been broken and almost destroyed by the colonialists during slavery and colonialism. The socialists and historians all agree on this. When we talk of Indians we talk of a group that comparative to the Africans has NOT been broken and destroyed. So let’s fire it up.

    Are Indians in Guyana politically superior to Africans, equal or inferior? I would say equal, since the two groups have had almost equal time ruling the country. In terms of political governance of the country, I would say the Indian majority PPP has been clearly superior to the African majority PNC. Comments to the contrary will be welcome.

    As for demographics, it’s a no brainer that the Indians are larger than the Africans ie superior in population.

    Culturally, it seems clear that Indians have a superior cultural heritage than the Africans, in the sense that Indian culture across the board is more developed and preserved. There is little or no African culture among those who claim to be African in Guyana, neither name, music, dance, clothing, attitudes or behaviour that we can see among genuine Africans. What Africans have is a mish mash of European, American, and some lately developed Caribbean cultural things. As I said, the white man broke the slaves mentally and culturally and the ex slaves in the colonial period.

    When it comes to economic enterprise and business, Indians in Guyana are clearly superior to the Africans. I don’t thing any evidence is needed for this point.

    In terms of educational achievement and drive for education, I would say Indians are superior to the Africans in Guyana as well.

    In sport, Indians are equal in cricket, inferior in soccer, basketball, boxing, netball, track and field. Give the Africans a superior here.

    Spiritually, it’s hard to make a judgement. Indians largely have their ancestral religions like Hinduism and Islam, and the Africans have the Christianity they had adopted from their former slave masters. Superior and inferior don’t work with religion.

    That’s my short list of comparisons, political, population, cultural, economic enterprise and business, education, sport and spirituality. You may draw your conclusions as to whether Indians would be justified in claiming superiority to Africans, as the African associations allege.

    Now as to the opposite, I will close with a question. Can Africans in Guyana justifiably claim to be superior to Indians, and if so, in what specific ways?

    Ram Jagessar

    • Youman  On October 29, 2017 at 9:20 am

      Yes Indians do think they are superior. They feel like the Chinese and Europeans that they came to Guyana to work hard and make a good life for themselves and open up business. The Africans didn’t and were seen as lazy . People soon left guyana after independence because the blacks were out of control. My father use to pay people to escort him home after shopping in fear of being attacked after the riots. Obviously this was the past so people should get over it and move on …..

  • hinduindianvoice  On October 29, 2017 at 7:07 pm

    And do the Africans consider themselves superior to the Indians in Guyana, Youman?
    Give your opinion, man. You are hiding behind a pen name. Nobody can do anything to you!
    And don’t come with that b.s about racism being in the past, so people should get over it and move on. That is just putting your face under the carpet. As for moving on, about 800,000 Guyanese have moved on… to America, Canada, Venezuela, Britain and left the problem behind.
    If nobody wants to tackle the race issue openly and honestly, and the race issue is the main issue in Guyana, what does that mean?

  • tata  On October 29, 2017 at 9:50 pm

    You know, I am very offended with the term African Guyanese. It is a RACIST term and has no place in a tiny country like Guyana, where culture is shared.

    How on earth can someone be born in Guyana and is called African.
    Fix this Sh###t.

    Every week, contributors to this blog obsessively writes about Donald Trump as a misogynist and Racist but overlook the FACT that we all came to America from a Bigoted country, where women are not respected and half of Guyana believe they are SUPERIOR to the other half.

    Moreover, history will tell, who is the INFERIOR of all the people brought to Guyana during Colonialism.

    Read your history and who are the UNTOUCHABLES!

    PLEASE!

  • Veda Nath Mohabir  On October 30, 2017 at 8:29 am

    This fella Tata talks about reading and is upset about the term African Guyanese. Did he READ the article above where at least three organizations attacking the ‘Indo’ PPP call themselves AFRICAN ?

    Secondly, does he know the origins o Untouchables? He like 99.9 % don’t but prefer to follow the Chritian churches and slam Hindus so they can get more converts. Hint: Historically, It has to do with beef eating. Hindus don’t eat beef, because the cow is considered sacred. Even Buddha was upset with killing the cow. So those who killed, ate, and dealt with cow caracasses and products were shunted – hence untouchables.
    Does he know that most societies Had/have “untouchables” including Africa?

    Veda Nath Mohabir.

    • Youman  On October 31, 2017 at 12:38 pm

      People can’t call themselves African or Indian if they are born in guyana. They probably can’t even afford to go on holiday to these countries so they are in fact guyanese because that is where they were born

      Unfortunately racism is still there. You don’t see black people sitting down to do puja or welcomed at the mandap when they have married an indian. Ive been to plenty mix race wedding but the white man is always welcomed in the dotee and jura jama at the hindu ceremony.

  • Veda Nath Mohabir  On October 31, 2017 at 2:01 pm

    So, when “You don’t see black people sitting down to do puja” that is racism?

    Who is being racist? Is it not possible that the “black people” don’t join in because the Hindu puja/havan is deemed heathen (as Christians are taught)?
    Hinduism is the most democratic, undogmatic religion. You don’t have to believe is a unique saviour or prophet to be accepted or be a Hindu. You think what I say is junk, you say???
    Read the following comment from a Ghanian Hindu!!!!

    1Beak1 1Beak1 • 5 years ago (commented)

    In response to Francis Q F. My brother it’s a pity you have missed out visiting the African Hindu Mandir in Ghana. Hinduism has been spreading in and beyond Ghana recently. It was a great that such wisdom has found root in Ghana. Now it’s time for Guyana to establish its BLACK MANDIR to the exclusion of none, where the leaders of the prayers are only women, that would be a classic. My commitment is political and a staunch advocate of Pan-Africanism. The African Socio-Political evolution is occuring at a thremendous price but every thing has a price as nothing from nothing leaves nothing, if you want something the you have earn it. As I understand, Guyana population is comprised of many of Ghanaian ancestry. As Peter Tosh sings “Mama Africa”. It is also my view that without Africa and South America there would not have been Capitalism, but that is another matter. Cheers.
    https://www.stabroeknews.com/2012/photos/05/27/members-of-the-african-cultural-and-development-association-acda/

    Or, you can ask Guyanese, Sharon Westmaas, or (Cosby Show) Phylicia Rashad!

    Veda Nath Mohabir

  • Gigi  On October 31, 2017 at 8:54 pm

    First off, this is your typical false equivalency argument put forward by this cabal of black alphabet groups to obscure and deflect from the ignoble and unconstitutional cherry picking of the Gecom chairman. Indo-Guyanese would have taken issue had this corrupt regime chosen a Surujbally or GKL “coolie”. However, had this crass regime chosen such a “coolie”, it still would have given the appearance of being neutral while knowing fully well that winning future elections through rigging would still be guaranteed. But I guess they feel embolden since massa did conspire to put them in power. What we are seeing on full display is them vying for the coveted uncle tom begging bowl. Except Asians aren’t supposed to be privy to this knowledge – this their burning desire and intense aspiration to be a chosen uncle tom.

    This apt quote by Frantz Fanon sums up their ordeal:
    “Man is human only to the extent to which he tries to impose himself on another man in order to be recognized by him. As long as he has not been effectively recognized by the other, it is this other who remains the focus of his actions. His human worth and reality depend on this other and on his recognition by the other. It is in this other that the meaning of his life is condensed.”

    Lastly, of course Indians do not want to be ruled by an African despot. Apart from Indo Guyanese lived experience of being ruled by African despots. Name one successful African country. Africans the world over are fleeing African ruled countries in droves. Not only are they spending large sums of money to facilitate their escape, many are also risking their lives in their desperation to flee. So, why would Indo-Guyanese want to be ruled by Africans when Africans themselves do not want to be ruled by Africans?

  • Gigi  On October 31, 2017 at 9:10 pm

    @ Veda Nath Mohabir, correct me if I’m wrong but it was only until recently that one could “convert” to Hindu. For the longest of time, one had to be born a Hindu. And if one became an outcast for going against the religious teachings, such as marrying out, eating meat, consuming alcohol, etc, one was expelled for life. This is what I’ve been told in discussions with Hindus from several Asian countries. And though there has been compromise made by the Hindu religion to protect and ensure its strength in numbers, converts of Hinduism are not fully embraced as the real deal or genuine article, so to speak. In this sense, Hinduism is similar to Judaism with its different sects that consider some more sacred than others, and so are excluded from certain practices. Kabbalah Judaism, a staple in Hollywood, comes to mind. BTW, Julia Roberts and Kirsten Gillibrand are also Hindu converts.

  • benny  On October 31, 2017 at 11:17 pm

    Why are we called Indians or Africans?? Is it too difficult for some of us to say GUYANESE? None of us were born in India or Africa. While I was growing up in Guyana my parents had some friends who were black. The two families were so close, that I was twelve years old before I realised we were not related. Both parents were Uncle and Auntie to each other’s children. The silly politicians should start being and behaving like real grown ups, then maybe, the rest of the citizens might follow.

  • Veda Nath Mohabir  On November 1, 2017 at 12:51 am

    Gigi: There is a difference between how people practise Hinduism and what the sacred texts actually say. There are two concepts in Hinduism when we talk of texts. There is ‘sruti’ (what is original/primeval, literally ‘heard’ in deep meditation viz., the Vedas) vs. ‘smriti’ = what is man-made and handed down/tradition). In the sruti of Hinduism, one needs NO conversion, whereas in the man-made tradition of rules/laws, which are subject to change – i.e. relative to time, place, locality etc., one can have rules of what a seeker needs to do, say to convert or to remain a true believer.
    For example, not sure if you ever hear the term “Kala Pani” = dark waters. According to the tradition, if one went abroad (out of India, across the seas (kala pani), one was deemed to lose caste and would have to perform various rites to recover status as a devout Hindu. The indentured labourers were faced with this dilemma.

    Bottomline is one really needs NO rites to make one a Hindus, as the Vedas say nothing of the sort.

    Otherwise, there would be no Ghanian or any other non-Indian Hindu. What ever rites (if any) are performed to make them Hindus are just in the minds of that guru at his/her tradition. Two other non-Indian Hindus are Hawaii congresswoman, Tulsi Gabbard and Robert Downey (had a clip in his last movie with him in India receiving a mala/garland, likely to give recognition to his spiritual home). Then there was Beatles Geo Harrison.

    When Robert Oppenheimer (director of Manhattan Project) tested the atomic bomb, the sight was so terrifying that he quoted a verse from the Bhagavad Gita where Krishna gave his disciple, Arjuna the ‘Divine Eye’, temporarily, to view Krishna in his Cosmic form (so versed Oppenheimer was on the Gita, most likely with Hindu sentiments, that the verse just slipped into his mind). Oppenheimer, as far as we know, never went thru any conversion rites.

    When Swami Vivekanada, became a star at the 1893 World Forum of Religions, he go a huge following, such as Henry Thoreau, Waldo Emerson and other ‘transcendentalists’. Many would be considered Hindus, as Rev Jennifer Ryu would describe in the sermon (see link).

    Here is where Hinduism differs remarkably from other faiths, and why I will always be a Hindu. Quantum Physicist, Dr.John Hagelin discusses ‘Veda and Physics: The Science and Technology of the Unified Field’

    VedaNM.

  • Veda Nath Mohabir  On November 1, 2017 at 8:28 am

    Another thing, Gigi, there is no hierarchical sects in Hinduism. No group is superior to another. Do you see Hindus slaughtering each other as the Sunni and Shia Muslims do on a virtually daily basis esp on their Friday prayer day in the name of Allah? Or what the Catholics and Protestants did all in the name of Christ? You can go to virtually any (non Aya Samaj) temple an see murtis of various sects together.
    I expect you will bring up the Caste system. In the ” srutis” the Vedas – texts of primeval knowledge / doctrines – there is NO caste system but a 4-fold Varna system to set out 4 lateral classes of functions in society – intellectual types, gov’t service and defence workers, commercial/business types and blue-collar workers. But, a person can also wear all 4 hats as most of us do.

    The origin of the Caste system is too complex to explain and will take much more time.
    Namaste! for now.
    VedaNM

  • Veda Nath Mohabir  On November 1, 2017 at 8:40 am

    That s/b “intellectual/knowledge” workers.
    VedaNM

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